西方不能只盯着阿富汗女性话题，发展权也是重要的人权
时事
2024-11-18 22:10
上海
塔利班政府执政三年来，阿富汗国内社会秩序和经济情况得到一定程度的好转，但美西方依旧紧盯阿富汗社会积弊已久的毒品和女性权益等话题，通过放大一些片面声音，继续误导国际社会对阿富汗和塔利班政权的认知。对此，北京对话和观察者网对话中国外交部阿富汗事务特使岳晓勇，通过介绍阿富汗的最新情况，以及包括中国在内的国际社会对阿富汗重建的援助，呼吁国际社会应对好阿富汗最紧迫的问题，比如贫困、饥荒、难民和恐怖主义威胁等等，为阿富汗重建提供建设性帮助。
韩桦：岳晓勇特使您好，谢谢您和北京对话与观察者网对话。过去三年来，您一直为阿富汗问题奔波忙碌。这次是刚刚参加完联合国有关会议，会见了相关的官员，从纽约回来。岳晓勇：在那之后，我们还去了俄罗斯，刚从莫斯科回来。韩桦：能不能和我们分享一下阿富汗问题的最新情况，以及中国对阿富汗的政策举措？岳晓勇：从2021年8月15日到现在，已经过去三年零两个月了。实际上，世界上那些关心阿富汗地区和平与重建、稳定与安全的人们，都在回顾这三年中发生的事情。就阿富汗问题的政治解决，阿周边邻国和国际社会也在思考迄今取得的进展，以及当前面临的挑战和机遇。中国作为阿富汗的邻国、地区伙伴，同时也是国际社会负责任大国，一直在持续关注如何携手各方为阿的和平、稳定和重建共同努力。最近，我和同事们在联合国大会期间去了纽约，参加阿富汗问题四国外长非正式会议等活动。中央政治局委员、中央外事工作委员会办公室主任、中国外长王毅出席了会议并讲话，俄罗斯与伊朗外长、巴基斯坦国防部长参加了会议。2024年9月27日，阿富汗问题四国外长非正式会议举行。外交部之后，应欧盟特使邀请，我去了欧洲，同欧方阿富汗问题特使团队和有关高级官员交流。然后去了莫斯科，参加由特别代表、特使和高级官员出席的“莫斯科模式”第六次阿富汗问题磋商会。上述两个会议都发表了联合声明。所有地区国家和邻国一致认为，在美国为首的北约对阿富汗失败的二十年占领之后，大家应坚定携手努力帮助阿富汗实现和平、稳定和重建。韩桦：在我看来，这是继习近平主席在和平共处五项原则发表70周年纪念大会重要讲话之后的最新外交举措之一。习主席强调中国在努力探索中国特色的热点问题解决之道，在阿富汗等国际与地区问题上发挥建设性作用。就像您提到的，这是中方推动解决阿富汗问题新的努力，持续发挥积极、建设性作用，推动阿富汗迈上和平稳定发展的道路。岳晓勇：是的，您说得对。回顾这三年，特别是近年来，第一，对于阿富汗问题的政治解决，中国的外交方针和行动，的确反映了我们国家领导人所明确主张的构建人类命运共同体的精神，体现出全球安全倡议，全球发展倡议和全球文明倡议的魅力。第二，阿富汗也是我们的重要邻国之一，两国沿瓦罕走廊有90多公里长的国境线。从上世纪五十年代，新中国成立后不久开始，两国就建立并保持良好的睦邻友好关系。在美国仓促地、不负责任地从阿富汗撤军之后的几天，我曾经接受过李世默先生（注：观察者网董事长）的专访，正是在我担任特使之后的出访期间。这次是第二次（接受观察者网和北京对话）专访。三年过去了，中方以实际行动与邻国、地区国家和国际社会以及阿富汗人民一道努力，推动阿的重建。这是阿富汗在过去20年甚至更长时间以来，第一次将他们国家前途命运掌握在自己的手中。我们同他们感同身受，我们希望他们成功。现在阿富汗人民终于有机会独立自主地恢复、重建自己的国家。所以我们立即和其他邻国一起，发起了邻国外长会，到现在已经开了4次会议了，并且即将召开第五次会议。中国、地区邻国以及国际社会的很多成员都认为，美国应该承担起对阿富汗重建的责任。直到现在，美国仍然冻结着阿富汗70亿美元的海外资产，仍然维持着对阿富汗的单边制裁。我们在国际上一直呼吁，阿富汗的海外资产必须解冻，所有单边制裁都应该解除。关于阿富汗塔利班，有人称阿富汗临时政府，有人称实控政权执政当局，不管怎么称呼，他们事实上已经掌握了这个国家。因此，国际社会有责任同他们建立接触，和阿富汗人民一起，努力推进重建。到目前，阿富汗已经在一些重建领域取得了令人赞叹的进展。比如说，他们已经基本全面掌控了这个国家并努力恢复治安，实施以经济为中心的发展政策，大力反腐，将毒品罂粟种植面积减少95%以上。各国应该对此给予肯定。2022年4月3日，农民在阿富汗坎大哈一处罂粟田采摘罂粟。阿富汗临时政府当天宣布，该国境内禁止罂粟种植及其相关产品交易。新华社他们也开始积极与外部世界互动，发展贸易，和本地区的国家以及邻国加强联系。联合国在两年前开始组织多哈特使会议。很多机构包括我本人都认为，联合国这个最大的国际组织应当在阿富汗问题上做出更多建设性努力。我们也一直在参与联合国多哈进程，我本人参与了每一场多哈会议。我认为，多哈会议目前最大的成果就是，在中国、邻国以及地区国家的持续呼吁敦促下，今年7月第三轮多哈会议，终于成功邀请阿富汗代表团临时政府参会，与其他的国际社会利益攸关方一起，坐下来对话。在第一次和第二次的会议上，没有成功邀请阿富汗代表团临时政府与会。现在，经过共同的努力，国际社会应该与阿富汗方面接触对话已经成为共识，也应该继续为阿提供人道主义援助。阿富汗面临的挑战和困难是真实的。这个国家有4000多万人口，但是根据联合国驻阿富汗援助团等联合国机构的统计，超过半数人口濒临饥饿，一直处在饥饿与贫寒的威胁中。由于多年的外国占领和战争，很多人背井离乡逃到境外。如果你问巴基斯坦和伊朗，他们会告诉你两国收留了数百万的阿富汗难民，他们需要更多的国际援助；我们一直在呼吁国际传统捐赠方提供更多帮助。许多国家都对阿富汗的恐怖组织问题深为关切，20年的外国军事占领使这个问题更为严重。根据不同的数据统计，在外国占领之初，那里仅仅有一两个恐怖组织，基地组织是最主要的一个，现在有20多个。20年的外国占领，造成了这个国家多少痛苦和磨难。许多国家关注那里的恐怖组织问题，中国也非常关注这个问题。在邻国外长会、四方会议或莫斯科模式特使会议等地区和国际社会讨论或联合声明中，反恐安全都是各方主要关切之一。这也是为什么中国一直积极参与各方对阿的和平与重建支持，汇集地区和国际社会的帮助，与阿富汗一起，实现包括反恐安全在内的共同目标。2022年4月23日，阿富汗民众在首都喀布尔领取中国援助的粮食. 新华社韩桦：像您说的，中国为解决阿富汗问题发挥了建设性作用。比如，您提到阿富汗减少了95%的毒品或者说鸦片种植，同时，他们在推行发展经济的计划。总的说来，中国为帮助解决阿富汗问题，与周边国家一同推行了很多创新的办法。在您之前接受的采访或者会议中，曾多次提到“三个尊重”、“三个从不”，这与美国对政治解决阿富汗问题所主张的态度、政策和双重标准形成对照。岳晓勇：美国在20年的失败占领之后从阿富汗仓皇撤军，中国则郑重宣布，我们对阿政策，将会一如既往秉持“三个尊重、三个从不”的原则，即：中方尊重阿富汗独立、主权和领土完整，尊重阿富汗人民做出的自主选择，尊重阿富汗的宗教信仰和民族习惯。中方从不干涉阿富汗内政，从不在阿富汗谋求私利，从不寻求所谓势力范围。韩桦：在目前进入更为稳定的阶段之后，下一步关于阿富汗问题的首要任务是什么？阿富汗妇女是一个热点话题，一些西方国家在给阿富汗妇女提供庇护。您怎么看这个问题？岳晓勇：是的，我们也注意这些问题。想要实现持久和平、稳定和重建，实现阿问题的政治解决，前面还有挑战和困难。整体看来，我们应该坚定地反对霸权主义、反对双重标准、反对地缘政治叙事、冷战思维或强权政治。这不仅事关阿富汗，也事关世界和地区和平、稳定与安全。这也包括要解决毒品和恐怖主义问题，使这个国家真正能够把命运掌握在自己手中，根据自身国情来实现发展，与周边和地区邻国一道实现重建和共同发展。在这方面，我们有很多事情要做。你刚才提到的妇女问题是重要的问题，也受到广泛关注。但这并不是阿富汗问题的全部，也不是阿富汗问题的核心和根源。我们应该继续关心阿富汗妇女，继续注意这个问题产生的影响，同时与国际社会一道，应对好阿富汗最紧迫的问题，比如贫困、饥荒、难民和恐怖主义威胁等等，支持鼓励阿富汗恢复和发展贸易、投资和重建。我们同时也在帮助这个国家的女性谋发展。人权不只是指政治权力和别的权力，发展权也是重要的人权。我们可以用更建设性的方式来帮助阿富汗重建，真诚地帮助他们去更好的保护人权，用平等和相互尊重的方式去交流和引导，使他们落实好保护和改善妇女儿童权益的承诺。我访问了阿富汗的邻国和地区国家，包括诸如沙特阿拉伯、阿联酋和卡塔尔等穆斯林国家，也访问了最大的穆斯林国家印度尼西亚。这些国家都希望发挥建设性作用，比如通过伊斯兰合作组织，分享作为穆斯林国家的治理经验，保护和改善妇女儿童的权益。同时我认为不应该以这类问题为借口，忽略最要紧的问题，诸如民生、人道援助、打击恐怖主义等等。这也是为何中国一直倡导要帮助阿富汗实现可持续的和平、稳定和重建，包括促进包容建政，温和施政等。中国这几年持续为阿富汗提供人道主义援助。从2021年8月以来，中国通过海、陆、空各种方式和渠道，提供了4.7亿元人民币的紧急人道主义援助。一些援助被用来帮助阿富汗接收从巴基斯坦和伊朗返回的数以百万计的难民回国。我们还对98%的阿富汗进口商品给予了零关税政策，扩大了松子的贸易。今年9月，习近平主席在中非合作论坛北京峰会开幕式上宣布，中方愿单方面扩大市场开放，决定给予包括33个非洲国家在内的所有同中国建交的最不发达国家100%税目产品零关税待遇。作为联合国认定的最不发达国家之一，阿富汗也享有上述优惠政策。我们正在考虑（进口）藏红花，这类农业项目有利于改善（阿富汗）普通人的生活，包括很多家庭妇女。这在阿富汗很受欢迎，就松子贸易一项，去年就达到5700万美元。韩桦：对中国消费者来说，阿富汗的松子的确质量上乘。在北京卖得挺贵，质量好，销量也很好。岳晓勇：这也是中国和阿富汗周边邻国决心继续为实现“屯溪倡议”所做的共同努力。2022年，第三次阿富汗邻国外长会由中国外长王毅主持，在安徽屯溪召开的，非常成功。“屯溪倡议”包括了70多个合作项目多项内容，将继续成为周边邻国和阿富汗之间持续合作的指导框架。事实上，邻国外长会机制已经成为帮助阿富汗实现和平稳定重建的非常重要、甚至是核心的国际和地区努力机制。中国也积极参与了其他的机制，我之前提到的联合国多哈特使会议、莫斯科模式特使磋商会、还有中俄伊巴四国外长会等，中国都有参与。实际上，一个和平、稳定、安全、繁荣的阿富汗，将使国际社会共同受益。韩桦：国际社会是否认为，中国处理阿富汗问题的外交政策有独特之处？岳晓勇：（中国）被广泛认为是一个积极因素。中国的贡献已经得到广泛的认可和赞赏，我们已经成为阿富汗自主和平和重建的重要支持者。中方认为应该同时动员所有周边邻国和本地区国家来一起努力。同时，我们强烈反对霸权主义、地缘政治和强权政治。阿富汗问题的政治解决符合国际社会的共同利益，一些外部国家却采用双重标准。美国有人说他们之所以要从阿富汗不负责任的仓促撤军，是因为他们想要跟中国展开战略竞争。这是在阿富汗问题上非常蹩脚的说辞和错误认知。我们不应该用强权政治的旧思维来对待阿富汗问题。就像开头说的，它应该成为国际社会共同努力构建地区命运共同体、邻国命运共同体和全人类命运共同体的机会和范例。2024年8月24日在阿富汗首都喀布尔拍摄的中国十九冶集团有限公司援建的住宅楼项目施工现场。新华社韩桦：我认为，中国的做法像是建立一个生态系统。外部发展需要政治经济的生态系统，解决阿富汗问题也是如此。作为特使，您在处理这些挑战的过程中，也像在建立一个生态系统。中国在其中所起的作用，就像是在外交领域提供韧性。岳晓勇：是的，特使只是整个过程中一个非常小的部分。中国作为世界上负责任的大国，不仅在阿富汗，也在解决其他的国际和地区热点问题上，一贯倡导和平发展、团结合作。不幸的是，这个世界总是遭到强权政治、双重标准、霸权主义和单边主义的干涉和干扰。因此我们要持续推动地区和周边邻国等各方一起努力，来实现阿富汗的和平与重建。韩桦：3年通常会被认为是解决一个国际问题的里程碑。所以3年过去了，下一步是什么？国际社会正期待中国在这个问题上，发挥更大的建设性的作用。岳晓勇：阿富汗是我们的邻国，也是国际社会、本地区以及周边邻国中一个重要的国家，中国将会继续秉持人类命运共同体和周边邻国命运共同体的理念，促进国际社会、本地区国家和周边邻国继续携手，帮助构建本地区更好、更安全的国际环境。我们应该继续让阿富汗周边邻国外长会机制发挥重要作用。同时，像上海合作组织这样的机构，在反恐和人道援助等方面也要继续发挥作用。我们还应该和阿富汗开展更多接触对话，加强提供人道援助。像您说的，这三年，我们通过共同努力，使阿富汗避免了国家的崩溃、避免了大规模难民外流，形势开始向好。我们应该继续开展务实合作，比如根据“屯溪倡议”和历次邻国外长会达成的共识，加强地区贸易、投资，增加交流，对阿富汗致力于以经济为中心的政策给予积极的回应，引导阿富汗分享本地区的未来，共同促进睦邻友谊。我们将会继续支持上海合作组织发挥作用，支持联合国发挥应有的协调作用。我们要继续反对强权政治，坚持国际正义，反对霸权主义，反对干涉别国内政。阿富汗应该成为一个合作各方平台，而不是地缘政治的角斗场。我们将会继续努力积极参与解决阿富汗问题。也因此，我们非常高兴地看到，有20到30个利益攸关方参与的第三次多哈特使会议，最终成功邀请阿富汗方面临时政府代表团参会，坐下来平等对话。这是非常好的开端。我们希望在各方共同努力下，阿富汗能从20年来被美国和北约占领的悲惨境遇中走出来，实现重建，找到适合自己的可持续发展道路。Han:Mr
Ambassador Yue, thanks so much for sitting down with Beijing Club for
International Dialogue as well as Guancha.cn during your very busy
schedule。So you've been traveling a lot for the past 3 years on the
Aghan issue。And you just came back from New York，attending UN meetings,
meeting with relevant officials.Yue：Actually from Moscow after that.Han:So
please share with us what are the frontline status quo of the diplomacy
and diplomatic work around Afghan issues？And what is the China policy？Yue:Thank
you，Ms.Han. That's a very good beginning with your question.
Indeed，since August 15，2021 with 3 years and almost 2 months passed, all
over the world and those who care for Afghanistan’s peace and
reconstruction，care for the regional stability and security, have been
recalling how much water has passed under the bridge in those 3 years
for neighboring, regional and the international community regarding
Afghanistan political settlement, also have been discussing how much we
have achieved and how much difficulties and opportunities are ahead, and
how much we, as Afghanistan’s neighbors，Afghanistan’s regional
partners，and also as a responsible member of the international
community, can continue to join hands for the peace and the stability
and reconstruction of Afghanistan.Recently，I and my team have
been to New York during the annual UN assembly. And our mission is to
attend four countries’ Afghanistan unofficial meeting. Our Political
Bureau Member, Director of the Foreign Office of Central Party Committee
and also Foreign Minister Mr. Wang Yi attended the unofficial foreign
minister meeting on Afghanistan in the sideline of the UN General
Assembly, namely China，Russia，Iran and Pakistan; Pakistan this time sent
their defense minister. After that，we went to Europe, invited by the
European Union Commission special envoy, to have dialogue with their
special envoys and leading officials. Then we went to 6th Moscow
Consultation Meeting on Afghanistan，participated by the special
representatives，special envoys and high level officials. Both meetings,
The New York four countries foreign minister unofficial meeting and
Moscow Format consultation meeting issued joint statements. It's the
general spirit that all those regional countries and neighbor countries
will continue to join their efforts to help Afghanistan for its
peace，stability，and reconstruction after 20 years failed occupation by
America and NATO.Han:That is another move in my opinion，another
diplomatic move after when Chinese president Xi Jinping mentioned during
the 70th years anniversary of the peaceful coexistence principle，when
he specified that Afghan issue and then the resolution and diplomatic
efforts on the Afghan issue is showing that China is playing a very
constructive role in resolving the regional or even the global issues.So
after 3 years，as you mentioned，this is like a step forward or a
milestone towards resolving the Aghan issue to make the country, through
the joint efforts，especially China is playing a very active role and
constructive role, to bring it to peaceful and a stable development down
the road.Yue:Yes，you're right。Looking back for those 3 more
years，number one， the approach and the policy, i.e. the action China has
been taking regarding the political settlement of Afghanistan, is
really reflecting what our top leadership has been advocating very
strongly, to build shared future for humanity with the three
initiatives: initiatives for common security, initiatives for
development, initiatives for civilization。In particular，as Afghanistan
is also one of our important neighbors, we share 93 some kilometers
border along the Wakhan Corridor, we have been having this good
neighboring country, neighboring relationships, ever from founding of
the People's Republic of China in the early years, last century in
1950s. After America's hasty，irresponsible withdrawal from Afghanistan,
August 15 2021, couple of moments，I remember we also had an interview,
with Eric Li, my first trip after taking office as special envoy; this
is the second special interview，3 years passed. So our approach
reflecting and recalling back, along with the guidelines and policies of
our top leadership, we have been following those guidelines together
with the neighboring countries，regional countries，the international
community, strongly advocate that we’d be together with Afghan people,
who is to for the first time over the past 20 years or longer, maybe
over the past 40 years, take the fate of the destiny of their country
into their own hands。We have all the sympathy for them. We hope they
succeed。Finally，they have the opportunity to reconstruct and
build their country independently。So we immediately engage and together
with neighboring countries, we set up the neighboring country foreign
minister meetings, up to now we already had four meetings, and we are
going to have the fifth one。In this point，I would say that we the
neighboring regional countries and many members of the international
community feel, it is the United States that should take the major
responsibility for all those suffering and destruction of Afghanistan
and they should take responsibility for the reconstruction of
Afghanistan.Up to now，United States still freezes Afghanistan’s
7 billion USD overseas assets and still maintains its unilateral
sanctions against Afghanistan. We have been calling for it to be
unfrozen and all those unilateral sanctions be lifted. If you look to
the Afghanistan itself，I should say that Afghanistan Taliban，some call
them the Interim Government of Afghanistan，some call them de facto
authorities, whatever you call them, They have actually controlled the
country and it is the responsibility of the international community to
engage with them, so that we can come together to work with Afghan
people for their reconstruction.Yue:The
current situation there you look at in Afghanistan shows they have
achieved for the transition of the country in quite a few fields and
impressive，for example，they have achieved, by and large a general
stability and control of the country. They began to implement a policy
focusing on the economic development, they have effectively reduce the
corruption of the country.They have dramatically cut down the drug
planting by over 95%. So all this we should give them due credits.Yue:They
have also actively begun to engage with the rest of the world， develop
trade and connecting with the regional countries and the neighboring
countries. The United Nations began to have Doha Special Envoys Meeting
since 2 years ago and they feel they should make more efforts to
engage。We also have been participating in the UN Doha (Special Envoys
meeting) process。I attended every Doha meeting. I think up to now the
biggest achievement in this Doha process is after repeated calls from
China，from neighboring countries and regional countries, finally，in this
year， I remember it could be in July, The third Doha conference
succeeded in bringing Afghanistan delegation to attend the meeting and
sit there with other stakeholders of the international community, to
have dialogue. In the first and second，the Doha process failed to invite
Afghan delegation to attend the meeting.Yue:Now after the joint
efforts，it has already become the consensus that we should engage with
the de facto authority there to facilitate dialogue. We should continue
to have the humanitarian assistance to the country. To this point，I like
to say that Afghanistan is also facing challenges and difficulties
ahead.For example，this is a country with 40 million some
population，but according to UNAMA’s report，and according to other
United Nations report，almost half of the population is in need of
assistance，humanitarian assistance，and over 20 million face hunger. This
country is always in the danger of hunger. And after repeated years of
foreign occupation and wars，there have been large amount of refugees
flowing out of the country. If you ask Pakistan and Iran， both countries
shelter respectively over millions，3, 4,or 5 millions of refugees or
those people flowing out of the country. They need more international
help。So we have been calling international donors to give more help.Yue：Many
countries also are concerned about the terrorism associated security
threat there。This is again the result of the 20 years outside foreign
occupation. In the beginning of the 20 years occupation by America and
NATO，there was only one or two terrorist groups there，now you look at
the different statistics, it is over 20。For China，we also are
concerned。If you look at each of the joint statements by
neighboring,regional countries or international community as a whole,
counter terrorism is always a major concern. How to work with
Afghanistan to finally have this country’s land clearly cut away from
terrorists threat or to really help Afghanistan to realize what they
have committed for CT security will continue to be an important aspects
of engagement。They have also said that they will not allow any of their
people，any of their own people or any forces use their land to threat
the neighbors.Han：You and your team or as you put it，China has
been playing a constructive role in solving the Afghan issue。I realize
that, so can you elaborate a little bit more, for example， when you
mentioned that Afghan has been cutting the drug or opium planting about
95%, and at the same time，it's been doing its own economic development
plan。What are the alternatives for this kind of cutting off of the drug
planting？So what are you doing to fill the vacuum of the revenues or
benefits from this drug planting? This is a very specific question。In
general，China for our readers and audiences，we've seen a lot of creative
approaches towards solving，collaborating with neighboring
countries，with regional countries in help solving the Afghan issues.In
some of the previous interviews or meetings，you mentioned about the
three respects versus the western or American led western attitudes or
policies towards, or double standards towards resolving Afghan issues.So can you elaborate more on these issues？Yue：You
raise a very good question。That's why, from the very beginning, after
America's irresponsible withdraw from Afghanistan after 20 years of
failed occupation, when China spoke about our approach，we very seriously
solemnly declared that we will hold our three respects and three nevers
principle，we believe that's very important to let world know that the
guidelines for our handling the political settlement of the issue, that
is China will respect Afghanistan’s independence，sovereignty and
territorial integrity。China will respect Afghanistan people， Afghan
people to make their own choice for their development。China will respect
Afghan people's religious and their national custom and practice, China
will never interfere Afghanistan internal affairs, and never seeks
selfish interests in Afghanistan, or never seek after so-called sphere
of influence.Han：So what are the next step policies, which will
be the priorities for the next step, to solving Afghan issues after they
are moving towards a more stable development status quo？There is a hot
issue regarding the status of the Afghan women。Some western countries
are providing so called asylum to these Afghan women.So what do you think of these？Yue:Yes，we
also noticed those issues, if we want to win a sustainable
peace，stability and reconstruction，to win the final solution of the
political settlement of the issue, we have challenges and tasks ahead.
My impression is that many countries hold that we should very much guard
against hegemonism, guard against the double standards, guard against
what some other countries said, so called geopolitical narratives，all
those either cold war thinking or the old ways of power politics. This
is actually an issue concerning the common good of international
society， concerning the peace，stability，security，not only about
Afghanistan, but also in the region and in the world.Those
challenges would include drug problem，narcotics planting，the terrorism
threat, and how to make sure to see a country finally get their destiny
into their own hands， how they make their own country stand up again
independently, and to go along according to their own conditions and
situations，realize their reconstruction and prosperity and enjoy the
common development with their neighbors in the region and return to the
international community.Yue:In
this regard， we have a lot of things to do. Regarding the woman issue,
it is an issue international and neighboring and regional countries have
been showing their concern, and it is also an important one。But that is
certainly not the whole Afghanistan issue。And it is also not the core
or root of Afghanistan problem。We should continue to care for
Afghanistan women, we should also work together to have international
community focusing on the most urgent，most pressing hardships and
difficulties of Afghanistan, like humanitarian disaster，the possible
famine，the refugees，the terrorists threat, while encouraging more trade
with Afghanistan，the investment，the joint efforts for the
reconstruction.We are all at the same time helping the woman and
girls of their country。If you look at the issue of human
rights，development rights is also included in the human rights。So the
challenge is rather how we take a mutual respect and equality approach
to exercise our guidance, to work with them， to improve protection of
both the interests and rights of woman and children.Yue:For
example，I have been visiting their neighboring and the regional
countries，including some other Muslim countries like the Gulf states,
Saudi Arabia，the UAE and Qatar，and also visited the biggest Muslim
country，Indonesia。All those countries would like to play a role, like
in the organization of OIC, to have the good exchanges with them, so
that they can compare notes as a Muslim country, how to better together
share their experience，mutual educational and guidance, to improve
together protection of the rights and interests of women and girls.I
don't think you should take that as an excuse to ignore the most needed
urgent issues，like livelihood of people，humanitarian
assistance，counterterrorism，and others。That's why China has been
advocating for winning the peace，sustainable peace，stability，and
reconstruction there should be (number one) inclusiveness in their
constituting the nation and national politics，(number two) the moderate
governance of the country.Certainly number three the
international community should continue to offer humanitarian assistance
and possibly development assistance。Number four，the security，
especially the CT associated security and also，number five, joining
hands for the common development of the country. Up to now ever since
August 2021, China with all forms and all channels，land，sea and air, has
been provided 470 million RMB of urgent humanitarian assistance。And we
have also been consulting with Afghan side how to implement our 1
billion RMB equivalent humanitarian and development material assistance。Part of it，as I said，is to help Afghanistan and also Pakistan，Iran to
have arrangement of the returnees from there，millions of the refugees.we have also offered zero tariffs treatment for 98% of imports from Afghanistan, and expanded our for example pine nuts trade.We
are considering saffron to let their agricultural farming play a good
role for improving their lives，including thousands of the common
peoples, women in their households。It is very much welcomed in the
country。And the pine nuts trade alone has already reached over $57
million.Yue:Afghanistan is a good pine nut exporter.Han:Afghanistan has really good quality pine nuts for Chinese consumers.Han:It’s sold in high price in Beijing, good quality, so good sale, best seller. So that’s a very big number.Yue:That's
why China has been advocating, calling for the neighboring countries to
work together to have a good implementation of Tunxi Initiative， which
was been held in China，Anhui Tunxi, as the third Afghanistan neighboring
country foreign minister meeting presided over by China, and by Foreign
Minister Wang Yi himself. Very successful, the initiative has already
mapped out seventy some items of the cooperation.It continues to
serve as a very good guideline for the continuous cooperation between
the neighboring countries and Afghanistan. Actually the neighboring
country foreign minister meeting mechanism has become a very important,
even the core mechanisms for the international regional efforts to help
Afghanistan for its peace and stability and reconstruction. China
also actively participated in some other mechanisms。I just mentioned
united nations Doha process, Moscow format, also China，
Russia，Iran，Pakistan foreign minister unofficial meetings also. All that
we believe helps。Actually，it is the common interests of the
international community as a whole to have peaceful，stable，and
secured，prosperous Afghanistan. international community，we
believe，shared common interests in this field.Han：The last
question，does the international community regard the Chinese approach or
Chinese methods of doing this Afghan diplomacy as a very unique one. we
have this kind of status.Yue:It is widely and accepted and
recognized as positive factor。And China's contribution is also widely
recognized and appreciated。We have become important contributor for the
whole process of the Afghanistan peace and reconstruction。China feel
that we should at the same time mobilize the whole neighborhood，the
regional countries and the international community, to work together
while strongly opposed to any，as I said just now,
hegemonism，geographical politics and power politics in play. Afghanistan
political settlement is a common issue, also to work on it is for the
common good of the international and regional countries as a whole. Some
other countries use the double standards，even some country said why the
United States got their irresponsible，hasty withdrawal，it's because
they want to have the strategic competition with China. That's a very
bad excuse or it is not a very appropriate talking regarding Afghanistan
issue.We don't believe Afghanistan is the issue of the old power
politics。As I said in the beginning，it is an example of how the
international community handles this as we are ready to have a shared
future together，have a shared future as a region，a shared future as
neighbor, a shared future for the mankind in the international community
as a whole.Han：For
me，China's way or Chinese approach is like building an ecosystem，not
only for the outside developments，they need their own ecosystem
politically，economically，but towards that direction，resolving of Afghan
issues and tackling the challenges among your special envoys，among
different countries, is like to build an ecosystem for Afghan issues，
resolution，and Chinese way, the role is like being the resilient part of
that, in that diplomatic community.Yue:Yes，I think special envoy
role is only a part of the whole efforts, is only tiny part of the
whole process。China as a major country in the world，we have been
advocating not only in Afghanistan，but in all the other regional hot
spots solving and international affairs what we called the peaceful
development path and to work together with the rest of the world, a
joined and shared future of mankind all along. Unfortunately， we have
always had this interference and disturbed by those power
politics，double standards, hegemonial and even unilateral way of doing
things. That's why we need to continue to mobilize the constructive and
good regional and neighboring efforts of the international community to
work for that peace and reconstruction of Afghanistan.Han:And to
apply some of your practices and experiences expertise to some other
international disputes，more and more international disputes nowadays。After 3 years，3 years is usually regarded as a milestone towards solving
an international issue。So after 3years，what are the next steps？The international community is expecting China playing a bigger role or
playing a more constructive role down the road.Yue:Afghanistan is
our neighbor as an important country in the international community as
well as the region. We'll continue to go along with the guidelines of
the shared future of humanity and of shared future of our neighbors. I
think there are several points，for example，we believe international
community，regional countries and the neighbor countries should continue
to unite to work together to help to have a better，stronger regional
common security.And from that， we should continue to let
Afghanistan，neighboring countries，foreign minister meeting
mechanism，play important role and together，for example，with some other
organizations like SCO Shanghai Cooperation Organization, to play their
role helping Afghanistan both for the CT security and humanitarian
assistance and others。And also there are some other organizations.And
secondly， we should have the comprehensive conversation of our measures
and actions to enhance our level of coordination in our providing
humanitarian and other assistance to Afghanistan. As you said，for those 3
years，our joint efforts have born good results in how Afghanistan
successfully avoided the collapse of the country, to have avoided the
large scale exodus of the refugees, and beginning to work ahead, and we
should continue to have that practical cooperation，for example，following
the Tunxi initiative and support the neighboring country foreign
minister meeting mechanism and enhance our regional trade，investment and
connectivity efforts, and give our positive response to Afghanistan
policy focusing on economy, their general guidelines of the policy, to
set up shared future of the neighboring countries and region, to be the
good neighbors in this region. And in that we will continue to support
Shanghai Cooperation Organization to play its role. We’ll also continue
to support the United Nations to play its due coordinating role for the
international community to help Afghanistan and to help Afghanistan to
improve their humanitarian dire situation for their reconstruction.
fourthly，of course，we will continue to be opposing ourselves to, or we
will continue to be opposed to power politics, and to safeguard justice
in the international community and against the hegemonial behaviors.That
is to say, to take Afghanistan as a platform of cooperation, instead of
using it as a geographical politics circus. We appreciate the Doha
meetings in the way that finally Doha meeting with 20 to 30 of the
stakeholders to have successfully invited Afghanistan sitting there to
have dialogue with the meeting，that's a good sign. Hopefully we can
continue work so as to help Afghanistan coming out of that dire
situation of the 20 years occupation of America and NATO, to realize
it's reconstruction and also to find their own way how to have a
sustainable development，with both internal political process, and the
external relationships with the rest of the world.Han:That is very comprehensive.Yue:Yes, we can continue to work on that.Han:I don’t think America would do that. Great. Thank you. I think this is a very good interview.来源|北京对话Beijing Club
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